An amazing amount of stuff here on NLT about the Kerry gaffe! Is there any reason to believe that at this stage many voters will change their votes from Republican to Democrat because of something John Kerry said? This is all a media frenzy. Republicans naturally grab what they can, and Kerry gave them a good one.

I suspect voters already knew he is dim, humorless, and self-righteous. What’s the news, the value-added?

Still, now we know the real secret: Kerry is an outed Republican agent.

I meant, change their votes from Democrat to Republican.

For me, the significance of this is that all the "flag-waving" on the Dims’ side is just window-dressing. Kerry’s "slip" is emblematic of how liberals REALLY feel about "Amerika." The rich get rewarded and the poor get shipped off to die for Halliburton.

This is precisely what I meant on another thread when I told Fung is "just didn’t get it." This kind of Marxist thinking denies the ideology & patriotism of our soldiers, and it paints them as stupid losers who are used as capitalist cannnonfodder.

Will it affect the election? I don’t know...if people are paying attention, perhaps it will energize some of the base. We’ll take it.

This just off CNN.com; Sen. John Kerry issues a statement saying: "I personally apologize to any service member, family member, or American who was offended" by comments he made about being "stuck in Iraq." Thank God THAT’S over!

Dain, stop reading the minds of liberals, we hate it when you do that. Even though I know that you endorse everything that Mark Foley ever did, I’m good enough to keep it to myself.

Who’s that with John Kerry?

James Webb

"It’s too late."

Sorry, Mr. Schramm, but this little Kerry tiff has only served to energize both Kerry and the Democrats. As far the the GOP base goes, I think the guys at Power Line have it about right. On the Kerry apology they simply replied "’twill do, ’twill do." In otherwords, this story is history, as well as the Republicans twelve year hold on Congress. It’s over, folks. Time to get ready for some new committee chair, um, persons. Duh fat lady’s done sung on this election. Just ask your pal Moser, he knows the score.

Gee, Dannyboy, so many words, so little substance.

Speaking of liking pictures, speaking of Power Line, speaking of being done, Power Line has estimated that 2 million people have now seen this picture which clearly drives the final nail in Jon Cary’s future presidential hopes, as well as his hopes to help Democratic candidates in ’06.

Kerry should leave humor to those who have a sense of it.

"This is precisely what I meant on another thread when I told Fung is "just didn’t get it." This kind of Marxist thinking denies the ideology & patriotism of our soldiers, and it paints them as stupid losers who are used as capitalist cannnonfodder."

I bet you used to laugh at "All in the Family" when Archie really gave that Meathead a piece of his mind.

Let’s analyze what you just said:

First, you have denied the obvious, which is that Kerry tried to tell a joke and screwed it up. The joke was meant for Bush, and he messed it up. So, let’s assume you are correct, and go on to the next logical conclusion: Kerry meant to say exactly what he said.

Do you really believe that? Do you really think that John Kerry, an officer in Vietnam, and a career politician meant to insult United States sevicemen and women in public?

Why in the world would he do that? Because only Republicans are smart enough to foresee the results?

All this shows is how desperate Republicans are for something to go their way. If there was something of substance that they could grab and use to their advantage, they would, but unfortunately for them, all of the substantive issues are bad news for their party: The growing acknowledgment that Iraq has been criminally mismanaged from the start, the moral ingenuousness of the "Family Values" party, the missing weapons of individual destruction this week, the growing and escalating death toll in Iraq, the continued freedom of Osama bin Laden, the resurgence of the Taliban, and the rigid, one-trick pony of a president, who spent all of his political capital, and all of our actual capital, and has nothing left.

So, you worry about a slip of the tongue. The rest of the country will worry about an unjust war, a budget deficit, health care, political corruption, Al Quaeda (where they are, and not where they are not), real education reform, real family values, (like being able to support your family with only one or two jobs per parent).

But, I am sure that you are the one who "gets it," and I have my priorites all wrong.

Fung, what you forget is that Kerry has made an industry cottage out of insulting soldiers, from calling them all war criminals to calling them the dumbies who couldn’t get into college. If you listen to the comment, there was no botched joke about it at all. He meant what he said - the military is supposedly made up of people who were too dumb to get into college. It is plain, obvious liberal elitism denigrating all those common people that liberals like to proclaim that they’re for.

Tony - What YOU forget is that he never called all soldiers war criminals, he only said that there were some war criminals among the soldiers. It was the apologists for the war criminals who suggested that to recognize a criminal is the same as insulting all soldier.

And I have listened to the comment plenty. It came out badly.

I’m with Ford on this one: Everyone accepted Dick Cheney’s apology for shooting his lawyer friend in the face. Why don’t you all accept Kerry’s for shooting himself in the foot?

You make Kerry sound so reasonable. Go back and read his congressional testimony. Oh, and his comment makes perfect sense the way it is - and shows perfectly his contempt for soldiers and ordinary Americans. But, go ahead and keep spinning it.

Sure, Fung, anything you say. Bad joke...check. Didn’t mean it...check. Has respect for soldiers...check.

As a spinmeister, you leave a lot to be desired. And again, you just don’t get it.

You are right. I am not good at spin. But then, I lack both the experience and the motivation. The good news is this: I have a great opportunity to learn at the feet of the masters. Turns out yet another evangelical preacher who has led the fight against gay marriage and is an advisor to the President.... is a sodomite! I bet a lot of people are trying to figure how to spin this one! Maybe I’ll just sit back and learn.

And you are right about another thing. How can you and your buddies pretend to be supporting the troops when you spend more time trying to trip up John Kerry than you do worrying about lost and stolen American weapons, escalating numbers of killed American troops, and a general disintigration in both Iraq and Afghanistan. I bet those troops feel very supported, begging for armor, for an effective strategy, for a leader who listens to his generals, and instead, their leaders are playing word games and pointing fingers like second graders, and cloaking their own corruption in patriotism that they never embodied themselves, but stole from the troops that were sent needlessly into an unjust war.

Maybe we need to define "support."

They are doing their job, and we appreciate it. How would you help them (other than cutting and running, thereby guaranteeing the need for their services at a future day)? Unlike you, Fung, these soldiers have some pride in their country and in themselves...they want to win, not surrender.

As for the minister, the reason that such scandals rock conservatives and not liberals is that conservatives have moral standards, whereas the Left makes crap up as it goes along. Your only God is power...admit it (and the truth shall set you free).

The gift that wasn’t.

How would I help them? I would start by having a clue about the complexity of Iraqi society. Bush couldn’t tell a Sunni from a Shiite from his own elbow, and had no idea what he was committing his troops to.

Then, I would listen to people whose advice made me uncomfortable, but which nevertheless might have some merit. People who suggested that Iraqis might NOT greet our troops as the French did when we delivered them from the Germans. People who told us that there were no WMD’s. People who suggested that Iraq might take more than a few weeks.

Then, I might listen to some generals whose lives had been devoted to military matters, but who retired instead of face the kind of humiliation and shame that Colin Powell was forced to endure.

Then, I might make sure that my troops had sufficient armor before people like Katie Couric, Charles Gibson, and Fung knew that it was necessary.

Then, I might have a frigging strategy other than "stay the course," which failed my father, failed me, and failed the nation.

Then, I might pay more attention to weapons, prisons, and the administration of the war than I did to avoiding Cindy Sheehan by hiding on my "ranch" in Texas.

I might acknowledge that I don’t know crap about the military, since all I did was avoid combat in the 70’s, and I might at least let the professionals do their jobs instead of put Rumsfeld in charge no matter what, the way I put "Brownie" in charge, and supported his travesty of an approach despite all evidence that he (and I) couldn’t "strategerize" our way out of a paper bag.

I might acknowledge that the "American way" according to George Bush is a very subjective, narrow prism for viewing the world, and that it could never successfully map onto a culture as different as Iraq, even in peace-time, much less when forced by an occupying army.

I might have the balls to acknowledge that I have been hearing this from the left since I first mobilized to invade Iraq, and I might admit that I was wrong, and they were right, and I have nothing left but to blame Iraq and the Iraqis for my own myopia and short-sightedness and my hubris and my shameless and criminal wasting of human lives for furthering my own personal and capitalistic ends.

That Webb/Kerry wedding photo is priceless. Webb looks like he just swallowed something really bad. Including every decent priciple he ever held.

Fung, you never cease to amaze me...just about the time I think you might be a reasonable person, this stream-of-consciousness poison flows forth. I’m really glad I don’t see the world the way you obviously do...sad, really. You must be a depressed person.

As for all your "substance," no one doubts that some mistakes were made (name me a single war where that hasn’t been true). Had Bush go in there and immediately partitioned the country, folks like you would have accused him of nation-busting (and I can only imagine what the Arabs would say). And for every general who say nay, there were two who said yea. Armor? Armor? Should we look up the voting records of noted liberals on military appropriations for the last 30 years? Ya wanna do that, Fung...come on, let’s play that game!

You leftists are whiny, back-biting hindsighters...the kind who throw in the towel after any reversal. You lack honor, and you are not my countrymen.